SGA fandom, I don't get you sometimes

[eretria]

Tell me, people:

When did fandom stop being fun and start becoming so incredibly hostile?

It saddens me unbelievably, because, there is enough drama in real life. Can't we at least stay civil and friendly in our LJ experience? Why the need for such hostility? Has this fandom grown too large? Isn't there enough food for thought anymore so that fen start to cannibalise each other?

I don't get it. Could someone explain the latent hostility that is flying around as of late?

I know I'm in it because I enjoy the show and because I love writing and because I like the people I have met through this fandom. I'm not doing anything because it's popular or not, and I know I have a couple of pretty damn unpopular points of view. I just ... why the need to be so confrontational and hostile? Seriously, do people not get enough adrenaline kicks in real life? Are those pissing matches really necessary?

(By the way, flisters, what I said last night about losing respect - I do hope you realise that none of this was aimed at any one of you. I'm not that passive aggressive)

Someone be my Erklärbär, please?

Comments

[munchkinofdoom.livejournal.com]

Having worked on s/f conventions for more years than I can count, I've long known that sections of fandom need very little provocation to go completely bonkers. *wry grin*

But SGA had, for quite a while, seemed pretty easy going. Unlike (for example) Highlander, which is renowned for eating its young, or Harry Potter, which would probably be improved if it ate a few of its members... *g*

But recently? What the hell has been put in the water supply? Because that's the only explanation I can come up with...

[sg1padawan.livejournal.com]

I am sooooooo glad I haven't actually ventured into SGA fandom as such. I have certain authors I'll occasionally read, or a particular link I may visit news-wise if I think it may be interesting, but I've largely stayed well beyond even the fringes of fandom. And I've never been more thankful for it.

SGA fandom has always seemed a little bit, well, out-there in terms of fannish-ness, but I think fandoms as a whole are becoming more batshit crazy than they ever used to be. *shrugs*

I'll just play in my own miniscule little sandbox, thankyouverymuch. It may be a little small, but it's safe and (somewhat) sane and I have no worries about people flinging sand in anyone else's eyes. *g*

[angelhunter.livejournal.com]

*meh*

I think the accumulation of big fat egos in SGA fandom has reached a critical mass and from that point onwards it was a downward spiral. Like in every other fandom that has grown beyond a certain size. (Harry Potter, Star Wars, Naruto, etc)

I know it is a rather pessimistic outlook on fandom, but I really think that there is a sort of progression through stages in every fandom. And SGA has obviously hit its puberty. Therefore all the wank. (Sorry, I know, my so-called humour isn't up up to snuff at the moment)

The best thing one can do is ignore all the big egos, the drama queens and entitlement bitches and concentrate on your circle of hand picked and reasonable co-fans.

[eretria.livejournal.com]

Must have been something pretty damn poisonous, because wherever you look, there seems to be wank popping up left and right, going: You're a bad fan because you're part of a group of a subgroup of a sub-subgroup who likes a major pairing in fandom, you're a good fan because you like a super-rare pairing like Hermiod/Atlantis sub-cook on the third messhall three levels down, you oppress me, no you oppress ME!
I mean, seriously. It's a TV-SHOW! Why don't people go into politics if they have such issues, and bring in all of their energy into places where it actually makes sense?

[eretria.livejournal.com]

Hand-picked and reasonable, that would be my flist, yes. And thank GOD for that.

I'm not even saying there are super-egos out there, because I really do try to see the good thing in people, but, what really gets me is that in all those discussions, it's always the same people popping up. And that makes me wonder: If they have so much to say, why don't they go into politics, bring their energy to make an actual difference, instead of just stirring up the masses in fandom and making people frustrated?

I agree, though, that the fandom has grown too large. That's not to say that smaller fandoms don't have problems, but it seems exponential the bigger fandoms grow. Which is sad.

[munchkinofdoom.livejournal.com]

I know! Good grief, we're not talking about folk being barred from jobs or housing etc etc due to race, colour, creed or somesuch. We're not even talking about folk banding together and demanding sga_noticeboard stop publicising rare-pairs! Or het! Or gen! *god forbid, it was the only way I found I found miss_porcupine's gen Lorne stuff!!!*

How the hell did this most recent kerfuffle manage to start with some little fan saying in her own lj that she was going to avoid the newsletter for a few weeks, to let a certain potential ship pass her by, turn into this massive McShep vs rare-pairs hate fest?

Fandom is strange. And lots of people must be bored, to have bought so heavily into this. While feelings had been running high in that previous race-wank, it was at least understandable as to how that wank grew into the behemoth it did.

But this? Arrrgh!

[eretria.livejournal.com]

Reasonable!Sez. You are in a safer place, for sure.
Though, I admit, I like living a little less safe but seeing all the good things fandom brings up, too.
But this entire wank? Is why is why I adore my flist. People are sane. There are people on it who write pairings I don't like, and who talk about pairings I don't like, but, you know what? I don't much care, because I don't have to read those particuar posts.

Seriously, as of late, people are acting as if they're being tied to a computer, have their eyes forced open and are being forced to read things they don't want to see.
Free will. It's a really nifty concept, that.

[http://users.livejournal.com/_inbetween_/]

But it must be on your flist, because enname and me didn't see or hear any wank at all.

(You gotta stop asking about human behaviour because I'm chomping at the bit here to "explain" it all to you and we wouldn't want that).

[eretria.livejournal.com]

I read about it because flisters were referencing it, and I am curious, as you know.

Check metafandom if you like. But, actually ... better don't.

Stop asking about human behaviour? Never. I want to understand. I don't want to just accept that people are crazy. If they are, and it's not me who is.

[eretria.livejournal.com]

Yes, it's just so *sad*.
I stand there, flailing, going: But, but, but, PEOPLE! Switch on the brain for a moment there, and be reasonable.

But, apparently? A sad amount of brains are being underutilised. Which, hey, when I'm really angry, I sometimes do, too. But there is a moment where it makes sense to just take a setp back and dissect why we are so angry, and if it really still has anything to do with the subject at hand.

[munchkinofdoom.livejournal.com]

Yep. As I said to someone else today, the Logic is not strong in fandom...

[eretria.livejournal.com]

Can I have an icon with that?

[http://users.livejournal.com/_inbetween_/]

It's funnier than you can know to hear me say: ignore it then! Don't go out to look for it if it's not even your circle of friends. (No, really, that is too funny, me saying that).

People are human. Nothing is inexplicable, especially not fandom.

[frogspace.livejournal.com]

When did fandom stop being fun and start becoming so incredibly hostile?

Buh? o_O

Hostile? I guess I must have missed it.

[eretria.livejournal.com]

Oh, a quick trip to metafandom should clear that up. Sadly.

[munchkinofdoom.livejournal.com]

*cackle* What picture would we use? Actually, Darth Vader would be awesome!

On the other hand, I want one of her response: Logic make Fandom go boom!

[eretria.livejournal.com]

It's an unhealthy interest. And, really, I wouldn't go engaging the people who started this directly, because I have zero interest in that.
However, I am always curious about why people do the things they do. It's my eternal question: Why. Why?

[http://users.livejournal.com/_inbetween_/]

If you are ever not tired and not at work, we can discuss that off LJ.

[eretria.livejournal.com]

We sure can.

[chopchica.livejournal.com]

I've gotta say, it doesn't really feel like it's *that* massive of a hate fest. It had the potential to be, but there was brief flare-up, one tiny spin-off post that nobody read, and my response post. I haven't seen anything else anywhere, aside from some, "I wish fandom wasn't so wanky" posts (which, boy, so do I).

Of course, given that I'm about to pop up in the new metafandom post and there's literally no way this isn't going onto Fandom Wank, I could end up being totally wrong.

[chopchica.livejournal.com]

Ugh, I wish I had something wise to say here, but I'm way too exhausted and spent all day answering comments (and going to the Earth Fair, which was *awesome*! Okay, I spent all day when I was *online*) and I'm kind of commented out.

[thady.livejournal.com]

Such things normally go by me. *shrugs* I usually ignore any wank. I don't have neither time nor patience for it. I don't know whether that makes me ignorant or something but honestly I don't care.

Usually the bigger the fandom gets the more wank pops up. There isn't much to be done about it. Sadly.

[nimnod.livejournal.com]

It is unfortunate, and contains the seeds of the destruction of all the things the wankers in fact hold dear, if only they could see it. It's a sort of nasty cycle in which the reasonable folk can only take the wankery for so long, and eventually get overly annoyed, and leave comms or leave LJ altogether. The wankers, unfortunately, are usually also the people who don't contribute much either creatively or intellectually, and thus they are left with nothing of substance to watch/read/look at/etc.

And that's enough being cynical from me for today.

[munchkinofdoom.livejournal.com]

I'm getting a bit on my flist, but most of it is locked, so it's staying there. *g*

The situation has made it onto Clairvoyantwank, but not onto F_W itself.

The only way I can gauge how big a kerfuffle is, is by how it effects my flist. On a countback since the metafandom post? I've had 5 posts by three different flisters, not counting the couple of references on the McShep comm. And for a small flist like mine, that's significant.

While the race-wank might have been wider spread, I'd have that this one has impacted my flist more...

The funny thing is, while the race-wank was probably a more serious topic, this one has produced the bigger WTF reaction in my flist... *g*

[enname.livejournal.com]

*points and laughs*

pot.

kettle.


black.

[http://users.livejournal.com/_inbetween_/]

Oi, but I understand it! Wise kettle! *sneezes* Even imparting wisdom one isn't able to adhere to.

[enname.livejournal.com]

Oh wisest of kettles, that is true. You've done it often enough to know how much you shouldn't be doing it.

(bless you)

[eretria.livejournal.com]

Ach, you know, in the cases I have in mind, the people are in fact smart. They do contribute. They argue in what appears to be an intellectually sound way. Only ... they fail to see where to end an argument. At some point, it's just arguing for the sake of arguing, and for the sake of sounding smart and impressing people, and that? Oh, that does not sit well with me. State your POV clear and succinct, and don't act as if you have to hold a lecture for university postgrads. It's not fair to anyone, and it certainly does not make you look any smarter. It rubs me the wrong way because I have a job in which I see too much of that - people trying to smother others with big words, when in fact, the very same thing could have been said simply and in just a few words. So this kind of behaviour really bugs me
Of course, that's just my opinion, and, seriously, I don't see why people should agree with me, seeing as I am just one amongst many, and not some very special pretty flower, but ... the effect it has for me is that it makes sure that I know which people to avoid, which links not to click and just generally whom to look at and think: Oh, that one again.

Hey. Hi.

[nimnod.livejournal.com]

I'm always more inclined to listen to the opinions of those who do in fact contribute.

...they fail to see where to end an argument...

Working in academia this is fairly familiar. Perhaps it's part of why I'm cynical. ;)

Have a good day =)

[eretria.livejournal.com]

You know, you should have just had fun and left fandom where it was - on the internet. Exhaustion from discussing matters which are mostly silly isn't good at all. ((Don't want you to have one more thing to answer in your post, but, yes, your reasoning was sound and very refreshing.)

Take a day off, sweets. Have some tea. Here?

[eretria.livejournal.com]

Normally, yes. I steer clear of those debates, if at all, I discuss them on the telephone where I can groan to my heart's desire, but it just grew so numerous lately that I felt the need to just voice my frustration and maybe find a reason, you know?

[eretria.livejournal.com]

Working in law, this is awfully familiar, too. I'm still working hard against my cycnicism, but, boy, do I know where you're coming from. ;o)

You too. Have some sunshine. Here.

[eretria.livejournal.com]

*looks at the two black kettles sitting in front of her*

Uhm.

[enname.livejournal.com]

Hey!

I don't go and read stuff that I know I truly don't want to read. Unlike certain people in this thread. If I really don't want to, I will listen, but most of the time I've already seen it.

Anyway. I always wear black : P

[eretria.livejournal.com]

q e d.

:o)

[enname.livejournal.com]

I am failing to see your quad erat demonstrandum there :P

I am pinstriped pot at the moment!

[eretria.livejournal.com]

Pinstriped is mostly black, though. Thin white lines! ;o)

[thady.livejournal.com]

Numerous? See, obviusly there *is* a lot passing me by.

But I get where you come from. You can only ignore so much.

[chopchica.livejournal.com]

Oh, hee! No, I was exhausted because it was four in the morning and like an idiot I was still awake, and because I walked something like three miles during the fair yesterday, not because of this. Like you said, exhaustion from discussing matters really isn't goot at all.

Thanks for the sound reasoning thing! And am drinking lots of tea. Had caramel rooibos last night and am examining straight-up Darjeeling for today.

[jwaneeta.livejournal.com]

I'm not in the fandom, but you'd have to be living on the moon not to have heard of the copious amounts of wank in SGA circles. It's quite amazing.

However... call me crazy, but it seems like civility in all sorts of fandoms is fraying. The shipwars in Buffy fandom were beastly, but they seemed to happen on one or two extremist sites -- now everybody's linked by LJ and one incautious word, forget outright wank, is like a spark to kindling.

It's a good thing I find wank so hilarious unless somebody I know is involved.